These include Adam Clarke. Also already taken care of. The Bible simply doesnt say. Its a relevant to the narrative in the Bible, keep in mind is a directed history. It is not a 100% record but rather Dimensions: 22 1/2 x 30 in. Was Rebekah 3-10 Years Old When Married Off To Isaac? word was brought to him [David] that Ahithophel had gone over to the side of Absalom, [49] https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionaries/eastons-bible-dictionary/ahithophel.html, brother of insipidity or impiety, a man greatly renowned for his sagacity among the Jews. Ironically, from an Islamic point of view, marriage at such a young age is prohibited (unless Bathsheba had somehow entered puberty as such an early age and was both socially and physically mature, which is unlikely). you have contributed so much great eye opening articles making Muslims and Christians aware of such controversial subjects. [69] https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionaries/smiths-bible-dictionary/ahithophel.html. 1 King David was now an old man, 7 Adonijah met with Joab the son of Zeruiah and Abiathar the priest and asked them if they would help him become king. [1] https://quranandbibleblog.wordpress.com/2020/06/10/the-age-of-marriage-in-the-bible/. another great academic article. Since David died when he was 70 years old, it means that he was 50 years old when Bathsheba (9-11 years old) gave birth to Solomon. The son of Ahithophel (2 Samuel 23:34). If we read 2 Samuel 12, when Nathan the prophet came to David, he provided the parable of the rich man and the poor man as a way to trap David into confessing his sin. Bathsheba had been married before she married David and she is the mother of The report came back: Isnt this Eliams daughter Bathsheba, the wife of Uriah the Hittite? 4 So David sent messengers to take her. Psalm 55 is a prayer of David asking God to save him from his enemies. Once David took the bait, Nathan pronounced Gods judgment: This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: I anointed you king over Israel Why did you despise the word of the Lord by doing what is evil in his eyes? Using Psalm 55:23, it would mean that Ahithophel could not have gone past the age of 45 years (note again that this is the, Even if David slept with a 7-year old, that does not mean that God approved of it!, This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: I anointed you king over Israel Why did you despise the word of the Lord by doing, Notice that the sin was in killing Uriah the Hittite. Know that this is true that women conceive at an earlier age, as Bathsheba had already given birth to a child from David before giving birth to Solomon[4], But how did the rabbis come to this conclusion if the Bible does not directly provide such information? Heb. The adultery scandal and the subsequent revolt by Absalom and Ahithophel would have required a clarification, but only if the author meant to refer to different people. And my master Joab and my masters troops are camping in the open field. There is no doubt that, initially, many will go into denial-overdrive. Read 2 Samuel 11:6-25. When he realized that Absalom had not taken his advice on how to fight David, Ahithophel knew that the conspiracy against the king would fail. 7 When Uriah came to him, David asked about the welfare of Joab and the army and how the battle was going. The only solution would be to assume that Ahithophel was mentioned in passing and was actually dead (the Chronicler states that Ahithophel was succeeded by Jehoiada). King Davids Marriage To 12 Year Old Abishag - Bible. He [David] now remembers that, at the heart of Absaloms rebellion, giving it direction and force, indeed making it possible, is Ahithophel., [33] https://www.blueletterbible.org/Comm/spurgeon_charles/tod/ps055.cfm?a=533001, It would be idle to fix a time, and find an occasion for this Psalm with any dogmatism. Died at 70 years of age. There is virtual consensus among the commentators that the meaning of this phrase is that Davids betrayers would not live half as long as people normally lived at the time. Thus, he went back to his home and hanged himself (2 Samuel 17:23). The son of Ahithophel (2 Samuel 23:34)., [93] https://www.studylight.org/commentary/2-samuel/11-3.html, Bath-sheba, the daughter of Eliam or Ammiel (1 Chronicles 3:5), one of Davids worthies (2 Samuel 23:34), and son of Ahithophel., [94] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/ckb/a/ahithophel.html, According to the Midrash, Ahithophel was Batshebas grandfather., [95] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/p/pelonite.html, [96] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hbd/p/pelonite.html, [97] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hdb/p/pelonite.html, [98] https://www.studylight.org/encyclopedias/mse/p/pelonite.html, [105] http://m.qtafsir.com/Surah-An-Nisa/Giving-Back-the-Property-of-th, Tagged as: 2 Samuel, Absalom, Age of consent, Ahithophel, Bathsheba, Bible, Child Marriage, David, Eliam, Psalm 55, par excellence. Most, though not all, of the evidence for the age of marriage comes from outside the Bible (i.e., from outside scripture), which some Christians ignore because it is not inspired. Moreover, Bathsheba was previously married to Uriah the Hittite, which means she could have been as young as 6 (or 8) when she married him. This article has offered a novel contribution to the seemingly unending and unnecessary debate between Muslims and Christians on the appropriate age of marriage and the baseless criticisms of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) for his marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her). While the enemies are not named, a man like myself, my companion, my close friend, with whom I enjoyed sweet fellowship. [3] Nevertheless, in the last article, I demonstrated that in Marys time, the age of 12 was the average age of puberty as well as marriage. Because, Im a Sunni Muslim and Im planning to debunk all anti-islamic claims and anti-islamic arguments. 23. The oldest man in the Bible, after the patriarchs, was Jehoiada, who supposedly died at the age of 130 (2 Chronicles 24:15). Note that this is the most conservative estimate. 25:3). Cmon bro, dont get me wrong. In a previous article, I demonstrated that the Bible generally allowed marriage and sex at the onset of puberty (with the exception of Numbers 31:18 which seemingly allowed sex even before puberty). Part of the reason for some Christians denial about child marriage in the Bible is that the Bible does not mention any specific age at which marriage could occur. Indeed, the account in 2 Samuel 1517 shows a man who was quite active, thereby suggesting that he was not an old man. Ellicotts Commentary for English Readers not only questions this interpretation but also the traditional assumption of Davidic authorship: Its date and authorship must be left in the region of mere conjecture. The success of Absalom would probably have been fatal to Bath-sheba; it would certainly have barred Solomon, Ahithophels great-grandson, from the throne. Webrussian central bank rothschild. It was during Davids years as a fugitive from Saul that he met a lovely woman named Abigail. David being the father of Solomon took the throne at age 30. He didnt go down to his own house. [1] In this follow-up article, I will present powerful evidence that will silence the rabid Christians who criticize Muhammads marriage to Aisha, inshaAllah. Thus, it also means that he was between 4448 years old when he first encountered Bathsheba, who was 79 years old. Other commentaries, such as those of Matthew Poole. Thus, the Talmud sages did not left out the 4 years that went by between Absalom and Davids reconciliation and the beginning of Absaloms revolt. What did Davids actions cost Bathsheba? In a previous article, I demonstrated that the Bible generally allowed marriage and sex at the onset of puberty (with the exception of Numbers 31:18 which seemingly allowed sex even before puberty). In this section, I will try to pre-empt some possible Christian objections. Why didnt you go home?, 11 The chest and Israel and Judah are all living in tents, Uriah told David. But the inference is really not a probable one. (2 Samuel 11:24) David didnt invite Bathsheba. The record does not make the impression that Ahithophel was an older man than David. That Ahitophel is the subject of Psalm 55:12-14; Psalm 55:20-21, is contrary to all we know of the history of the rebellion of Absalom (, There is no hint that the writer is a king whose authority is threatened by a formidable insurrection. Ahithophel was known as Davids counsellor, [41] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/pmc/psalms-55.html#23, And the prayer here used is followed with another in the history, to turn the counsel of Ahitophel, an enemy of his, but held in great reputation, into foolishness., [42] https://www.studylight.org/commentary/psalms/55-13.html, My guide my counselor; as Ahithophel was to David (1 Samuel 15:12; 1 Samuel 16:23)., [43] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/kad/psalms/55.htm, This Old Testament Judas is none other than Ahithphel, the right hand of Absalom., [44] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/lange/psalms/55.htm, In retaining this reference to David, however, we are not to think of Doeg, Ps. Examining Quran 9:29 - Does Islam Sanction The Killing Of Christians & Jews? a native of Giloh, was a privy councillor of David, whose wisdom was highly esteemed, though his name had an exactly opposite signification. [32] John Phillips, The John Phillips Commentary Series: Exploring Psalms: An Expository Commentary, Vol. WebAPI Access. As Jonathan Brown explains: the medieval ulama considered the point at which a girl was fit for intercourse to be too varied to be firmly legislated for. Uriah the Hittite and Eliam, being both of the kings guard (consisting of 37 officers), were intimate, and Uriah married the daughter of his brother officer (https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/a/ahithophel.html). But, let us be even more generous and round it up to 80. The traditional ascription to David cannot on any ground be maintained. Tomorrow Ill send you back. So Uriah stayed in Jerusalem that day. Absalom calculated on his adhesion from the first (2 Samuel 15:12); the history does not directly say why, but incidentally it comes out: he was father of Eliam (or by transposition Ammiel, 1 Chronicles 3:5), the father of Bathsheba (2 Samuel 11:3; 2 Samuel 23:34; 2 Samuel 23:39)., [9] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hbd/a/ahithophel.html, He may have been the grandfather of Bathsheba, Davids partner in sin and wife, [10] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hdb/a/ahithophel.html, Being Bathshebas grandfather, he had been alienated by Davids criminal conduct, [11] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/mbd/a/ahithophel-.html, A Gilonite, grandfather of Bathsheba, and a very wise counsellor of David, [12] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/rpd/a/ahithophel.html, Some have endeavored to account for Ahithophels treason by the supposition that, as it seems likely he was Bath-shebas grandfather, he wished to revenge on David the evil done to her. I am the author, and I have already debunked IC on Rebekah. But what if we can use the Bible to reliably estimate the age of another famous female character in the Bible: But how did the rabbis come to this conclusion if the Bible does not directly provide such information? So, here is a summary about Ahithophel and his role during Davids reign: If Ahithophel was Bathshebas grandfather, then determining his approximate age would allow us to estimate Bathshebas age as well. As shown, David was declaring that those who had betrayed him and were trying to kill him will not live out half their days. If this was the normal lifespan at the time, and the bloodthirsty and deceitful will not live out half their days, then we can reasonably estimate Ahithophels age to less than 40 years. And Ahithophel began to counsel Absalom on how to destroy David. The evidence in question comes from the infamous marriage of David and Bathsheba. Son of Ahithophrl and father of Bathsheba (https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/e/eliam.html). For Davids close counselor and friend, Ahithophel, actually revolted against David when Absalom did. The couple had concluded the marriage contract when Aisha was only six but had waited to consummate the marriage until she reached physical maturity.[103]. The world was vastly different back then. If Ahithophel was Bathshebas grandfather, then determining his approximate age would allow us to estimate Bathshebas age as well. See here for the sheep ate the Quran polemic: Could you also tell or contact the author of this article telling him that a man having a channel called Islam Critiqued claimed to have refuted or debunked the marriage of Rebekah and Isaac. We have already seen evidence in a previous article that the marriage was Biblically valid. So, we should follow Muhammads example and only allow marriage at an age that is appropriate for the time. He could have been as old as 11 years if we assume that the four years in 2 Samuel 15:7 refers to the time from Absaloms return from Geshur (2+3+2+4=11). 3 David sent someone and inquired about the woman. [88] Many commentators also say this, including Barnes,[89] Trapp,[90] George Haydock,[91] Bullinger,[92] and the Jamiesson-Fausset-Brown Commentary. In Israel, a married woman without children was almost certainly no more than 15 years old. King David Create. And also, can you subscribe and follow my website? The Pulpit Commentary adds (emphasis ours): Of course, the statement is not intended for a universal law, and indeed was probably pointed especially at the bloody and deceitful men of whom the psalmist had been speaking. There is no hint that the writer is a king whose authority is threatened by a formidable insurrection. The Mount of Olives is adjacent to the city of Jerusalem, so David would have had a good view of the city and thus, assuming he wrote the psalm, could have been describing his feelings at the time. And Allah (Glorified and Exalted be He) knows best! Note that this estimate is higher than the age assigned to Ahithophel by the Jewish sages. Not only was this marriage permitted, it resulted in the birth of yet another beloved figure, Solomon. This is the thing that really hurt David, is that Absalom had turned against him., [35] https://www.studylight.org/commentary/psalms/55-13.html, as mine equal: i.e. This relationship probably led to Ahithophels disloyalty (2 Samuel 15:12)., [18] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/ghe/2-samuel-15.html#1, Ahithophel was very likely the grandfather of Bathsheba, [19] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/hcc/2-samuel-11.html#3, The grandfather of Bethsabee is supposed to have revolted against David, to revenge the wrong done to her., [20] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jfu/2-samuel-23.html#34, Eliam the son of Ahithophel the Gilonite , [ Eliy`aam (Hebrew #463)] omitted in the parallel list of 1 Chronicles 11:1-47; traditionally believed to be the same as the person mentioned, 2 Samuel 11:23 (Jerome, Quaest. That Ahitophel is the subject of Psalm 55:12-14; Psalm 55:20-21, is contrary to all we know of the history of the rebellion of Absalom (https://biblehub.com/commentaries/ellicott/psalms/55.htm). This is confirmed by most dictionaries, including Smiths Bible Dictionary,[6] the American Tract Society Bible Dictionary,[7] Fausetts Bible Dictionary,[8] the Holman Bible Dictionary,[9] Hastings Bible Dictionary,[10] the Morrish Bible Dictionary,[11] the Peoples Dictionary of the Bible,[12] and the Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological and Ecclesiastical Literature. [73] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. He didnt lure her. Note that this is the most. 23), but of Ahithophels unfaithfulness and the rebellion of Absalom (Chald., the Rabbins, and most interpreters), and indeed not after the outbreak of the rebellion, but shortly before it.. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. [68] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. The reality is that they were the most likely the same person. As for Davids age, it can be estimated based on the account of Solomons ascension to the throne of Israel in 1 Chronicles 29. The bottom line is that there is no evidence to support the claim that there were two Eliams. Surah 70 Verse 30 which Christians take out of context. I believe that you have misunderstood my comment. He lived well past half [the] days of the normal lifespan. In addition, Gills Exposition of the Entire Bible explains, based on the Talmudic interpretation, that (emphasis ours): bloody and deceitful mendo not come up to the half of the ordinary term of mans life, which is threescore years and ten.[54], Heb. He had no pity for Bathshebas grandfather Ahithophel, Davids trusted friend and adviser, [16] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/dcc/2-samuel-15.html#1, Ahithophel (2 Samuel 15:12) was probably Bathshebas grandfather (2 Samuel 11:3; 2 Samuel 23:34)., [17] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bul/2-samuel-11.html#3. Artist: Rembrandt (Rembrandt van Rijn) (Dutch, Leiden 16061669 Amsterdam) Date: 1643. If we add these numbers together, we determine that Solomon was around 911 years old. Figure 1: Map showing how far Ahithophel would have travelled in the short-lived coup attempt by Absalom. By the way, I made a website and I have debunked the claim which you have made Allah the Moon God. The woman was very beautiful, and David sent someone to find out about her. He didnt trick her. Since this is now firmly established, we may ask what relevance it has in determining Bathshebas age at the time of her marriage to David. Or Ammiel, [1 Chronicles 3:5] who was the son of Ahithophel, [2 Samuel 23:34] who might, for the dishonour done by David to his niece Bathsheba, be the readier to conspire against him, and to take part with Absalom., [22] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/isn/psalms-41.html#1, Ahithophel was the grandfather of Bathsheba., [23] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/lmg/2-samuel-15.html#1, The reason for this strong enmity was likely that Ahithophel was the grandfather of Bathsheba, [24] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/mac/2-samuel-12.html#13, He was Bathshebas grandfather; and we are not going wrong, I think, in tracing his passionate hatred, and the peculiar form of insult which he counselled Absalom to adopt, to the sense of foul wrong which had been done to his house by Davids crime., [25] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tsk/2-samuel-23.html#34, Eliam: 11:3; 15:31; 17:23; 1 Chronicles 27:33,34, [26] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tbi/2-samuel-12.html#14, What swept Ahithophel into the ranks of that great conspiracy? [62] Later, Ahithophel was with Absalom in Jerusalem. Grants Commentary on the Bible,[23] Alexander McLarens Expositions of Holy Scripture,[24] R.A Torreys Treasury of Scripture Knowledge,[25] The Biblical Illustrator,[26] and The Pulpit Commentary.[27]. WebDavid in His Old Age. Hebraicae, in loco), the father of Bath-sheba. From the roof he saw a woman bathing; the woman was very beautiful. This directly contradicts the account in 2 Samuel 17. It is not known how old David was when he met Bathsheba. 10 David was told, Uriah didnt go down to his own house, so David asked Uriah, Havent you just returned from a journey? [68] Similarly, Smiths Bible Dictionary states that he was approximately 32 years old and died around 1023 BCE (emphasis ours): a native of Giloh, was a privy councillor of David, whose wisdom was highly esteemed, though his name had an exactly opposite signification. Wiki User. Log in. The Targum is, but thou Ahithophel; of whom the words are literally to be understood, and so they are in the Talmud (u); and mystically and typically of Judas. The estimation of Bathshebas age is indeed based primarily on the interpretation of Psalm 55, and especially verse 23 (see objection #2 below). We can see from the example of Barzillai that people could have lived into their 80s at that time, but this seems to have been the upper limit. They will vociferously deny that Bathsheba was around 7 years old (or perhaps as old as 9) when she first encountered David and they will deny that she was the granddaughter of Ahithophel. Why is it assumed that a 3040 years old Ahithophel could not have a granddaughter? [60] Wesleys Explanatory Notes also suggests this interpretation but is rather vague. So says the Benson Commentary (emphasis ours): Not half so long as men ordinarily live, and as they, by the course of nature, might have lived, and as they themselves expected to live, but shall be cut off by Gods just judgment, by an untimely and violent death.[52]. If we assume that the four years refers to the time from the commencement of the criminal schemes (per Barnes), that means that Solomon was no older than 9 years (2+3+2+2=9). Bullingers Companion Bible Notes,[17] Gary H. Everetts Study Notes on the Holy Scriptures,[18] George Haydocks Catholic Bible Commentary,[19] the Jamiesson-Fausset-Brown Commentary,[20] John Trapps Complete Commentary,[21] Ironsides Notes on Selected Books,[22] L.M. Though this is said to be a prayer of Moses, who probably lived some 250 years before the reign of David, it still finds corroboration in the time of David, since Barzillai was 80 years old at the time of Absaloms revolt, and David himself lived for 70 years. 12 Then David told Uriah, Stay here one more day. WebBathshebas husband Uriah was back to war, so they were married over a year. Only a minority of scholarly sources questioned this attribution, but the reasons they provided were weak (see note #49). Talmud Niddah 29b; Halacha is clear, ritual bath must be done during the morning hence, there is no connection with Bathsheba who took a bath during the night (2 Samuel 11:2). Actually, God had no problem with it. However, this was clearly not the norm (even if true). Her father and grandfather were often at the The answer comes from Psalm 55:23 (emphasis ours): But you, God, will bring down the wicked into the pit of decay; the bloodthirsty and deceitful will not live out half their days. David was sinful because he had taken another mans wife, not that he had slept with a 7-year old. Others may come to accept the evidence presented but will still attempt to downplay it. People were ready to take on the responsibilities of marriage and family by the time they reached puberty. Some Bible dictionaries mention both Eliams without any additional information. If Solomon was 11 years old at the time of Ahithophels death (the non-conservative estimate), then Bathsheba would have been around 9 years old at the time of Solomons birth. Marriage and family by the time to support the claim that there no. Days of the normal lifespan the birth of yet another beloved figure, Solomon as... 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